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	<title>Comments on: Is Paul Krugman feeling any better now?</title>
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	<link>http://www.historyishappeningnow.com/2009/04/12/is-paul-krugman-feeling-any-better-now/</link>
	<description>Yet another political blog</description>
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		<title>By: Lee</title>
		<link>http://www.historyishappeningnow.com/2009/04/12/is-paul-krugman-feeling-any-better-now/comment-page-1/#comment-829</link>
		<dc:creator>Lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Apr 2009 02:20:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historyishappeningnow.com/?p=2627#comment-829</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Not that it matters much, but Krugman spent a year on Reagan&#039;s Council of Economic Advisers, and was considered for a position in the Clinton White House; he claims to be temperamentally disinclined to work in government.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not that it matters much, but Krugman spent a year on Reagan&#8217;s Council of Economic Advisers, and was considered for a position in the Clinton White House; he claims to be temperamentally disinclined to work in government.</p>
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		<title>By: Ian</title>
		<link>http://www.historyishappeningnow.com/2009/04/12/is-paul-krugman-feeling-any-better-now/comment-page-1/#comment-828</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Apr 2009 02:08:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historyishappeningnow.com/?p=2627#comment-828</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I think it is relevant to point out that Krugman has never done anything in his life except academic work and writing. He has never been in a position of responsibility similar to the positions held by Summers, Geithner, etc. There&#039;s nothing wrong with being an academic and a columnist, but the reality is that Krugman lives in a world where important mistakes are never made. If Krugman makes a profound mistake -- such as warning that a trillion-dollar-plus plan won&#039;t work when actually it will -- the only consequences are that Krugman&#039;s reputation diminishes. If Tim Geithner or Larry Summers make a similar mistake, the consequences will affect hundreds of millions of people all over the world. It&#039;s right for us to blame them for the part they played in screwing up our economy -- but if they can fix their mistake, it will be an accomplishment far more admirable and significant than anything Krugman is likely to do in his life. Perhaps some of us would like to give Krugman the opportunity to acheive or fail on this massive scale -- but the opportunity belongs, rightly or wrongly, to Summers and Geithner. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;My only hope is that liberals who think Larry Summers and Tim Geithner MUST be wrong about this bailout plan will realize their mistake when Summers and Geithner lead us back to economic growth, reasonable levels of unemployment, etc. If you want an America where &quot;those who proved to be correct/competent were also those who made policy,&quot; you can start by giving Geithner and Summers credit when the economy is back on track in three years.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it is relevant to point out that Krugman has never done anything in his life except academic work and writing. He has never been in a position of responsibility similar to the positions held by Summers, Geithner, etc. There&#8217;s nothing wrong with being an academic and a columnist, but the reality is that Krugman lives in a world where important mistakes are never made. If Krugman makes a profound mistake &#8212; such as warning that a trillion-dollar-plus plan won&#8217;t work when actually it will &#8212; the only consequences are that Krugman&#8217;s reputation diminishes. If Tim Geithner or Larry Summers make a similar mistake, the consequences will affect hundreds of millions of people all over the world. It&#8217;s right for us to blame them for the part they played in screwing up our economy &#8212; but if they can fix their mistake, it will be an accomplishment far more admirable and significant than anything Krugman is likely to do in his life. Perhaps some of us would like to give Krugman the opportunity to acheive or fail on this massive scale &#8212; but the opportunity belongs, rightly or wrongly, to Summers and Geithner. </p>
<p>My only hope is that liberals who think Larry Summers and Tim Geithner MUST be wrong about this bailout plan will realize their mistake when Summers and Geithner lead us back to economic growth, reasonable levels of unemployment, etc. If you want an America where &#8220;those who proved to be correct/competent were also those who made policy,&#8221; you can start by giving Geithner and Summers credit when the economy is back on track in three years.</p>
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		<title>By: Lee</title>
		<link>http://www.historyishappeningnow.com/2009/04/12/is-paul-krugman-feeling-any-better-now/comment-page-1/#comment-827</link>
		<dc:creator>Lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Apr 2009 02:07:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historyishappeningnow.com/?p=2627#comment-827</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&quot;But the reality is that Summers and Geithner are in charge. You can blame Obama for this injustice. But critizing the financial rescue plan put forward by Geithner just because you think it’s unfair that he’s in charge is childish and highly irresponsible. If we’re going to criticize their plan, it should be because we honestly think their plan won’t work.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I completely agree.  The plan should be assessed on its own merits and demerits.  If Hitler were to say that 2+2=4, we&#039;d have to concede the point, &#039;cause it&#039;s true.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Also, I think Krugman should be criticized for his errors in judgment, analysis, etc.  I think in fact that there&#039;s plenty of ground to criticize his blanket dismissal of the Geithner plan.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;My own relatively poorly informed gut assessment of the Geithner plan goes something like this:  no one really knows if Geithner&#039;s plan will work.  No one even quite knows how to define the criteria for &quot;work,&quot; either.  Geithner&#039;s strongest independent defender (that I&#039;ve been able to find), Brad DeLong, explains his support for the plan with a sort of rhetorical shrug of the shoulders, by saying something like:  it can&#039;t hurt, and if it doesn&#039;t work we can just go on and nationalize.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;But the reality is that Summers and Geithner are in charge. You can blame Obama for this injustice. But critizing the financial rescue plan put forward by Geithner just because you think it’s unfair that he’s in charge is childish and highly irresponsible. If we’re going to criticize their plan, it should be because we honestly think their plan won’t work.&#8221;</p>
<p>I completely agree.  The plan should be assessed on its own merits and demerits.  If Hitler were to say that 2+2=4, we&#8217;d have to concede the point, &#8217;cause it&#8217;s true.</p>
<p>Also, I think Krugman should be criticized for his errors in judgment, analysis, etc.  I think in fact that there&#8217;s plenty of ground to criticize his blanket dismissal of the Geithner plan.</p>
<p>My own relatively poorly informed gut assessment of the Geithner plan goes something like this:  no one really knows if Geithner&#8217;s plan will work.  No one even quite knows how to define the criteria for &#8220;work,&#8221; either.  Geithner&#8217;s strongest independent defender (that I&#8217;ve been able to find), Brad DeLong, explains his support for the plan with a sort of rhetorical shrug of the shoulders, by saying something like:  it can&#8217;t hurt, and if it doesn&#8217;t work we can just go on and nationalize.</p>
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		<title>By: Ian</title>
		<link>http://www.historyishappeningnow.com/2009/04/12/is-paul-krugman-feeling-any-better-now/comment-page-1/#comment-826</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Apr 2009 01:54:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historyishappeningnow.com/?p=2627#comment-826</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;You may be right that Larry Summers, Robert Rubin and Tim Geithner don&#039;t deserve to be in charge of running our recovery. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;But the reality is that Summers and Geithner are in charge. You can blame Obama for this injustice. But critizing the financial rescue plan put forward by Geithner just because you think it&#039;s unfair that he&#039;s in charge is childish and highly irresponsible. If we&#039;re going to criticize their plan, it should be because we honestly think their plan won&#039;t work.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Furthermore, there is no doubt whatsoever that the burden of proof rests squarely on the sholders of Obama, Geithner and Summers. If their plan fails, it will be their failure and nobody else&#039;s, and the American people will have learned their lesson, which is that they cannot trust Democrats to make sound fiscal policy.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;There is no question that the next two years will provide plenty of evidence to show who was correct when the rubber met the road. Was it Obama, who wisely put Larry Summers and Tim Geithner in charge of rescuing our financial system? Or was it Krugman and his followers, who said over and over again that their plan wouldn&#039;t work.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;My point in criticizing Krugman is merely to point out that he isn&#039;t a great beacon of insight when it comes to the economy. He&#039;s just a man with an opinion, and people who pay attention to Krugman should actually understand Krugman&#039;s arguments before adopting them as their own.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You may be right that Larry Summers, Robert Rubin and Tim Geithner don&#8217;t deserve to be in charge of running our recovery. </p>
<p>But the reality is that Summers and Geithner are in charge. You can blame Obama for this injustice. But critizing the financial rescue plan put forward by Geithner just because you think it&#8217;s unfair that he&#8217;s in charge is childish and highly irresponsible. If we&#8217;re going to criticize their plan, it should be because we honestly think their plan won&#8217;t work.</p>
<p>Furthermore, there is no doubt whatsoever that the burden of proof rests squarely on the sholders of Obama, Geithner and Summers. If their plan fails, it will be their failure and nobody else&#8217;s, and the American people will have learned their lesson, which is that they cannot trust Democrats to make sound fiscal policy.</p>
<p>There is no question that the next two years will provide plenty of evidence to show who was correct when the rubber met the road. Was it Obama, who wisely put Larry Summers and Tim Geithner in charge of rescuing our financial system? Or was it Krugman and his followers, who said over and over again that their plan wouldn&#8217;t work.</p>
<p>My point in criticizing Krugman is merely to point out that he isn&#8217;t a great beacon of insight when it comes to the economy. He&#8217;s just a man with an opinion, and people who pay attention to Krugman should actually understand Krugman&#8217;s arguments before adopting them as their own.</p>
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		<title>By: Lee</title>
		<link>http://www.historyishappeningnow.com/2009/04/12/is-paul-krugman-feeling-any-better-now/comment-page-1/#comment-825</link>
		<dc:creator>Lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Apr 2009 01:31:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.historyishappeningnow.com/?p=2627#comment-825</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Given that Geithner and Summers are clearly not going to listen to anything their critics say, we have before us a great opportunity to test the ideas of those who are skeptical of Geithner&#039;s plan.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I endorse the assumption that underlies your claim that a reputation should be linked to the accuracy of predictions...&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Let&#039;s call it the Accountability Stress Test, and let&#039;s say it works this way:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;(i) When person X says something that proves to be disastrously wrong, person X&#039;s credibility should diminish.  Consequently, we should become more skeptical of subsequent things person X says, keeping in mind that past performance is no guarantee of future success (or failure).&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;(ii) When Person X is correct about something big that other people miss -- like the existence of a housing bubble, the dangers of financialization -- we should pay more attention to that person&#039;s views in the future (keeping in mind the same caveat).&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So when Robert Rubin, Alan Greenspan, and Larry Summers worked together to prevent the regulation of credit-default swaps and other derivatives, on the theory that firms like AIG would never if unregulated take on potentially self- and system-destroying risk, then we discover -- as critics predicted -- that AIG and other firms did exactly that -- we should think in the future that the burden of proof is on them, not those who were right in warning us about the dangers of the financialized economy in the first place.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Reputation is of course a loose way to assess the seriousness of someone&#039;s claims.  Rubin may be right about one thing, wrong about something else, right today, wrong tomorrow, right the day after.  And the world economy is a complex system even the most talented and educated economist understands only poorly and partially.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Nonetheless, we would be right to observe that the credibility of Rubin, Summers, Greenspan, etc.--though dead--seems to be no barrier to their preferred solution becoming U.S. policy.  It is as if a surgeon botched an operation, leaving you on the cusp of death, then was allowed to resume operating on you, this time to save your life.  You would never let that be done to you, whether or not you understood the technical details of how medicine works; but in areas of economics, the U.S. seems eager to do just that to itself.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Imagine if we lived in a country where those who proved to be correct/competent were also those who made policy.  What a novel fantasy!  Not in our America.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Given that Geithner and Summers are clearly not going to listen to anything their critics say, we have before us a great opportunity to test the ideas of those who are skeptical of Geithner&#8217;s plan.</p>
<p>I endorse the assumption that underlies your claim that a reputation should be linked to the accuracy of predictions&#8230;</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s call it the Accountability Stress Test, and let&#8217;s say it works this way:</p>
<p>(i) When person X says something that proves to be disastrously wrong, person X&#8217;s credibility should diminish.  Consequently, we should become more skeptical of subsequent things person X says, keeping in mind that past performance is no guarantee of future success (or failure).</p>
<p>(ii) When Person X is correct about something big that other people miss &#8212; like the existence of a housing bubble, the dangers of financialization &#8212; we should pay more attention to that person&#8217;s views in the future (keeping in mind the same caveat).</p>
<p>So when Robert Rubin, Alan Greenspan, and Larry Summers worked together to prevent the regulation of credit-default swaps and other derivatives, on the theory that firms like AIG would never if unregulated take on potentially self- and system-destroying risk, then we discover &#8212; as critics predicted &#8212; that AIG and other firms did exactly that &#8212; we should think in the future that the burden of proof is on them, not those who were right in warning us about the dangers of the financialized economy in the first place.</p>
<p>Reputation is of course a loose way to assess the seriousness of someone&#8217;s claims.  Rubin may be right about one thing, wrong about something else, right today, wrong tomorrow, right the day after.  And the world economy is a complex system even the most talented and educated economist understands only poorly and partially.</p>
<p>Nonetheless, we would be right to observe that the credibility of Rubin, Summers, Greenspan, etc.&#8211;though dead&#8211;seems to be no barrier to their preferred solution becoming U.S. policy.  It is as if a surgeon botched an operation, leaving you on the cusp of death, then was allowed to resume operating on you, this time to save your life.  You would never let that be done to you, whether or not you understood the technical details of how medicine works; but in areas of economics, the U.S. seems eager to do just that to itself.</p>
<p>Imagine if we lived in a country where those who proved to be correct/competent were also those who made policy.  What a novel fantasy!  Not in our America.</p>
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